Which country has the best education in the world? - The Global Story podcast, BBC World Service

Lucy Hockings introduces Sean Coughlan, a former education correspondent, and John Jerrim, a professor at UCL's Institute of Education, to discuss global education. Sean explains that the most common measure for comparing education systems is the PISA tests, which assess 15-year-olds in reading, maths, and science across approximately 80 countries. These tests, introduced by the OECD, allow countries to compare their educational achievements and understand that their systems are not inevitable and can be improved.

John identifies East Asian countries like South Korea, Singapore, and Hong Kong as consistent top performers in PISA tests. Estonia and Canada also do very well. Sean notes that historically wealthy European nations like France, Germany, and the UK often underperform compared to these "fast upcoming countries." The argument for PISA is that it measures skills essential for a knowledge economy, and these high-performing countries are outpacing others. Sean also highlights that many top performers are small, relatively new, and ambitious nation-states, often lacking natural resources and therefore focusing on human capital.

Lucy raises the question of what a "good education" truly entails, acknowledging concerns about the stress levels of students in some high-achieving East Asian countries. John agrees that a good education is broader than just academic results, and the OECD is trying to incorporate measurements for "softer skills" like creativity and well-being into PISA through questionnaires. Sean explains that countries take PISA rankings seriously because education is seen as a major economic driver. He cites Singapore's investment in education since the 1960s as a deliberate strategy to become a high-skill, high-income country.

Examining what works, Sean explains that successful PISA countries often prioritise equality, ensuring all pupils achieve a certain standard regardless of background, as exemplified by Shanghai's past model. There's also discussion about the starting age for school, with John noting no clear international evidence for an optimal age, as long as pre-school education is provided. John then stresses the vital importance of teacher quality, stating that good teachers can significantly boost a child's learning gains, though it's not the sole factor explaining international differences.

Sean discusses the US PISA results, highlighting wide disparities between states, with some, like Massachusetts, performing exceptionally, while others fare poorly, leading to a mediocre national average. The conversation then shifts to the 224 million children globally needing educational support, with 72 million unable to attend school due to war, conflict, poverty, and other barriers. Sean describes the long-term, devastating impact of a lack of education on individuals and societies. The dire situation in Afghanistan, where girls over 12 are denied education, is highlighted. John notes that in OECD countries, girls typically outperform boys, particularly in reading.

Sean believes education systems can change and that PISA tests demonstrate that outcomes are not inevitable. Lucy brings up the impact of increased funding in her local London borough, leading to improved standards. Sean agrees that money is a vital starting point, ensuring adequate teachers, equipment, and a supportive learning environment. However, he also points out that how money is spent matters, noting that reduced class sizes, for instance, don't always have a significant impact according to PISA data. Ultimately, educational outcomes are a choice made by societies, reflecting their values and priorities, and can be changed through policy decisions.